Count Me Out.ie

General discussions
HylandPaddy
Posts: 220
Joined: Sun Apr 26, 2009 5:17 pm
Location: Co. Donegal

Re: Count Me Out.ie

Post by HylandPaddy » Tue Apr 27, 2010 3:49 pm

lostexpectation wrote:
I sent mine at the start of the year and didn't get a reply till the middle of March. I had to confirm my choice and send it away again. Still waiting.
is this really necessary?
No, it's not. If I spent the time getting my hands on the defection form, filling it out and sending it away surely it means I thought it through. I think it might be a last ditch attempt to make you think twice, that makes me happy - it means that it matters to them that I'm leaving.

The problem the Catholic church don't realise is that not every member on the register is a catholic or supports the church. Most of the young generation have no interest in the Church, it is only kept alive by the older generation. We have become more secularised in the last couple of decades, but old catholic Ireland is still within living memory. Society has changed but there is still a base-line of old die hard catholics, we have to wait until they die or their influence is diluted by the next generation.

We still might have relatively high mass attendance and "cultural" catholics, but that is far better than real die hard catholics. I think the evolutionary line goes like this:
staunchly catholic - a la carte catholic - "cultural" catholic - cuddly "church of england" catholic
For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring.
-Carl Sagan
Rational_thinker
Posts: 39
Joined: Mon Jan 04, 2010 3:02 pm

Re: Count Me Out.ie

Post by Rational_thinker » Mon May 10, 2010 2:08 pm

Still haven't heard back on my application so have now approached the Bishop's secretary (Arundel and Brighton diocese in England) directly to ask what process they recognise.

Going to ask a lawyer friend if I can force them to act if they continue to ignore me...
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence Carl Sagan
What can be asserted without proof can be dismissed without proof. – Christopher Hitchens
People who don't like their beliefs being laughed at shouldn't have such funny beliefs Unknown
Reilly616
Posts: 55
Joined: Mon Aug 02, 2010 1:42 am

Re: Count Me Out.ie

Post by Reilly616 » Mon Aug 02, 2010 2:35 am

I sent mine and got a reply a couple days later (Cloyne). As my brother did so aswell, I know it's a stock, automated response. It asks to confirm whether or not you would like a meeting first. I replied saying no and asking for a reply when my details had been amended. That was three weeks ago. So I've just sent a third letter setting a deadline for them based on the Data Protection Acts. I'm looking forward to how they reply to that, and when!

To those of you who don't know; in Ireland if you ask them to change your details, they have to do so within 40 days. So no need to be waiting around for months for a reply. If they aren't answring you, the next step is to contact the Data Protection Commissioner.
Tulip1
Atheist Ireland Member
Atheist Ireland Member
Posts: 1529
Joined: Sat Aug 08, 2009 1:07 pm
Location: Sligo

Re: Count Me Out.ie

Post by Tulip1 » Mon Aug 02, 2010 5:08 pm

Reilly616 wrote:I sent mine and got a reply a couple days later (Cloyne). As my brother did so aswell, I know it's a stock, automated response. It asks to confirm whether or not you would like a meeting first. I replied saying no and asking for a reply when my details had been amended. That was three weeks ago. So I've just sent a third letter setting a deadline for them based on the Data Protection Acts. I'm looking forward to how they reply to that, and when!

To those of you who don't know; in Ireland if you ask them to change your details, they have to do so within 40 days. So no need to be waiting around for months for a reply. If they aren't answring you, the next step is to contact the Data Protection Commissioner.
Thanks for that, I know somebody waiting for his response. I will tell him.

Maybe you can post adraft letter?
Pope says atheists pick & choose their morals. Correct. Today I will be frowning on child abuse & not having a problem with homosexuality.
Reilly616
Posts: 55
Joined: Mon Aug 02, 2010 1:42 am

Re: Count Me Out.ie

Post by Reilly616 » Tue Aug 03, 2010 12:33 am

Tulip1 wrote:
Thanks for that, I know somebody waiting for his response. I will tell him.

Maybe you can post adraft letter?
Sure! Mine's a bit ballsy, as I'm a law student so I don't mince my words about these things, but feel free to take what you want from my letter--I'll just post it as I sent it. By the way, the Data Protection Commission has a great website here: http://www.dataprotection.ie/docs/Home/4.htm So, hope these help! Here's what I sent:
I wrote:Archbishop Dermot Clifford,

As I have yet to receive a reply to my second letter to the Cloyne Diocesan Office—sent approximately three weeks ago—in relation to my wish to formally defect from the Catholic Church, and have also yet to receive confirmation of the amendment of my details in the baptismal register, I am writing to inform you that you are under a statutory obligation to comply with my wish in a timely fashion.

Section 6(1) of the Data Protection Act, 1988, as amended by the Data Protection (Amendment) Act, 2003 states:

“An individual shall, if he so requests in writing a data controller who keeps personal data relating to him, be entitled to have rectified or, where appropriate, blocked or erased any such data in relation to which there has been a contravention by the data controller of section 2(1) of this Act; and the data controller shall comply with the request as soon as may be and in any event not more than 40 days after it has been given or sent to him”.

Section 2(1)(b) states that “the data shall be accurate and complete and, where necessary, kept up to date”.

As the data is no longer up to date, I am requesting, under section 6(1), that this contravention of section 2(1) be rectified.

As your first and only response to my request was sent on 7th July 2010, this is the latest date that it can be argued my request in writing was “given or sent” to you. Thus, under the legislation, you have until 16th August 2010 to comply with my request or to indicate why you refuse to do so.

I would be grateful if you could communicate with me once the relevant changes have been made. Under section 6(2) of the same Act, 16th August 2010 is also the deadline for notifying me.

Regards.
So, that's what I sent. If the date comes and goes without reply, I'll probably send a fourth giving them some extra time but stating my intention to make a formal complaint to the Commissioner.
lostexpectation
Posts: 1993
Joined: Wed Feb 07, 2007 11:28 pm

Re: Count Me Out.ie

Post by lostexpectation » Tue Aug 03, 2010 12:39 am

so how long does the process take on average, ? how soon do you get your first reply then your second? to snail mail?
test
Reilly616
Posts: 55
Joined: Mon Aug 02, 2010 1:42 am

Re: Count Me Out.ie

Post by Reilly616 » Tue Aug 03, 2010 12:44 am

lostexpectation wrote:so how long does the process take on average, ? how soon do you get your first reply then your second? to snail mail?
Well, as I've mentioned above, I got my first reply after two days since it was an automated reply. The second reply has not yet arrived. I've been waiting over three weeks now. But remember; however long they take, you are entitled to the change being made (or them explaining why they refuse to change it) within 40 days!
Tulip1
Atheist Ireland Member
Atheist Ireland Member
Posts: 1529
Joined: Sat Aug 08, 2009 1:07 pm
Location: Sligo

Re: Count Me Out.ie

Post by Tulip1 » Tue Aug 03, 2010 11:42 am

Thanks Reilly616, I will pass it on! Very usefull!
Pope says atheists pick & choose their morals. Correct. Today I will be frowning on child abuse & not having a problem with homosexuality.
Reilly616
Posts: 55
Joined: Mon Aug 02, 2010 1:42 am

Re: Count Me Out.ie

Post by Reilly616 » Tue Aug 03, 2010 4:18 pm

Tulip1 wrote:Thanks Reilly616, I will pass it on! Very usefull!
Glad I could help! :D
Reilly616
Posts: 55
Joined: Mon Aug 02, 2010 1:42 am

Re: Count Me Out.ie

Post by Reilly616 » Tue Aug 10, 2010 1:38 pm

Well, after sending that last letter, I received a reply just 6 working days later. (And just 4 working days before the statutory deadline!) I have now completed my defection. :D
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