IT comment by Breda O Brien

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a.thjeist
Posts: 12
Joined: Sat Jul 25, 2009 5:44 am

IT comment by Breda O Brien

Post by a.thjeist » Sat Jul 25, 2009 5:55 am

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/opi ... 03564.html

Premise is that atheism is a religion too

Once again, a religious person (and I'm getting mighty tired by the standards of journalism that allow this non-argument to proliferate) attempts to "explain" atheism as a "faith".

I posted a comment, under moderation so I'll post it here, I'm sure I won't offend anyone, I said

*********
Dear Breda

I am a rational person, therefore i will analyse your argument rationally. You state, and correct me if I'm wrong, but this is the premise of your entire argument :

"the decision not to believe in God lies ultimately in the arena of gut feeling, or hunch, or intuition"

Wrong.

We simply choose not to adhere to your belief as there is no evidence to suggest we should.

Once again a religious person attempts to make atheists look like they have a "faith", and I'm sick of it. We are not "opposites", Breda, we are not "extremes of the same thing", we are different.

Get used to it, and stop pretending otherwise.

There is a secondary premise mentioned in your article which is unrelated to the article's conclusion, but as a religious person you can't avoid the tempataion of scoring brownie points with your imaginary friend. you say

"Christopher Hitchens and Richard Dawkins. Their target is religious fundamentalism. "

No. Their target is religion. Your religion. That of the ancient Celts. The one the people in the Middle East practice. Mormonism. Kabbalism. "Spirituality" in any sense it is mentioned (often by charlatans of all descriptions).

So, back to the drawing board, and accept that atheism and religion are incompatible. We are not opposites, we are just not interested.
*********

Will atheists EVER be seen as people with normal, rational open minds that are simply not interested in mind games?

I've seen this "live and let live" nonsense from religious posters before. It terrifies religious people to think that maybe JUST MAYBE, there is no god and no need for a religion. So, they see this atheism take more and more defined shape [or lack thereof] before them and they assume that it's simply another religion, with lots of lovely people in it too, as if a nun were being open minded to Islam or Hinduism.

Historically, when religions feared "strangers", they first demonised them, which worked to keep the group happy, but of course didn't change the "others". Then they engaged in treaties. Then they began ecumenism (a sort of detente) as way to signal that they won't engage in war if the "others" won't, which then evolved into some sort of parity of esteem, and then of course back to spouting their nonsense to their flock (how apt a collective term)

Meanwhile, as Irish newspapers and editorial permission allow journalists to round on those that DON'T subscribe to faiths, the transgressions against humanity enacted by faiths worldwide don't enter into debate. "Heaven forbid" a catholic journalist criticise the enforcing of the hijab, or draw cartoons of the prophet.

rant over

hope you all have a nice day!
lostexpectation
Posts: 1993
Joined: Wed Feb 07, 2007 11:28 pm

Re: IT comment by Breda O Brien

Post by lostexpectation » Sat Jul 25, 2009 6:58 pm

good response, so thats 3 IT columnist who wrote about the meeting

there was straight report on it by the IT thought wasn't there?

ah yes this

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ire ... 43694.html
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FXR
Posts: 3176
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Location: Dublin

Re: IT comment by Breda O Brien

Post by FXR » Sat Jul 25, 2009 8:36 pm

Ireland has changed: the parish pump crawthumper has discovered lipstick and bronzer..... :roll:
Human communication is a very rickety rope bridge between minds. Its too narrow to allow but a few thoughts to cross at a time. Many are lost in the chasms of noise, suspicion, misinterpretation and shooting the message through dislike of the messenger.
andrew
Posts: 97
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2007 2:22 pm

Re: IT comment by Breda O Brien

Post by andrew » Mon Jul 27, 2009 10:42 pm

Breda O'Brien is a nasty piece of work. She's a condescending school teacher who is also on the board of the iona institute, David Quinn's nut house of right wing catholics. The Irish Times seem to be running some sort of campaign against atheism. It used to just be the mad proffesor Reville but now they have O'Brien and Waters writing almost weekly about the dangers and stupidity of not believing in a christian god. Atheist Ireland have really annoyed them!
Emm....would anyone like to see my monkey impression?
a.thjeist
Posts: 12
Joined: Sat Jul 25, 2009 5:44 am

Re: IT comment by Breda O Brien

Post by a.thjeist » Tue Jul 28, 2009 7:42 am

Nice. She's in charge of shaping young people's minds.

My (fervently catholic) aunt is a granny, and she was telling me how her granddaughter asked her mother who taught the first man to speak. Mother ummed and awed, saying his mammy and daddy (now THERE'S an answer) and the kid say no the FIRST man, who had NO mammy and daddy. Mother flaied a bit and said "It was Holy God!", thereby settling the argument. Granny was chuckling at how kids ask the darndest things. And here's her granduaghter being taught some seriously screwed up ways of thinking and it doesn't cast her a thought...

Anyway I also think the IT is selling papers. The Indo has been running this atheist-religious-baiting gag for a year with letters and columns, and I'm sure the IT finally caved in and got involved in this "controversy".

Mind you what a sappy "thought piece" it was. and the responses like "Can science prove only scientific evidence is the only way of knowing the universe" would try the patience of a saint, as they say. Or the old hoary chestnut of "Yo still haven't proved god doesn't exist"... jeayyyziizzz

And then the "atheists have no sense of humour, wonder, social conscience.. etc etc blah blah" do these people even think AT ALL??

I'm just aghast at the stupidity in the world. no wonder Ireland is screwed when one of the main papers allows this crap to be printed. Because articles in papers carry weight. Cause they're supposed to have been vetted. By people who are paid to think.

Oh god, hit me with the freedom of speech now why don't you...

As if all Irish atheists were not THEMSELVES once brainwashed christians. piffle. And we laugh at the Yanks for their evangelical nonsense. at least they make better money out of it.
bipedalhumanoid
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Re: IT comment by Breda O Brien

Post by bipedalhumanoid » Wed Jul 29, 2009 7:11 am

I've never been able to get a letter published explaining the flaw in the claim that atheism requires faith in either the IT or the Indo. It's a shame. Such an easily refutable and commonly held beLIEf. The IT didn't publish any letters refuting O'Brien's article today.
"The fact of your own existence is the most astonishing fact you will ever have to face. Don’t you ever get used to it." - Richard Dawkins... being shrill and offensive again I suppose.
lostexpectation
Posts: 1993
Joined: Wed Feb 07, 2007 11:28 pm

Re: IT comment by Breda O Brien

Post by lostexpectation » Wed Jul 29, 2009 8:25 am

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what about blasphemous comments?
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