2006 Census of population

General discussions
CitizenPaine
Atheist Ireland Member
Atheist Ireland Member
Posts: 462
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2006 8:49 pm

Post by CitizenPaine » Thu Mar 29, 2007 9:33 pm

zhollie wrote:I always maintain that if the progressive and rational elements of our society are to have any impact or undermine the influence of religion then we have to get ''god'' out of the schools. Those who desire religious instruction for their kids should do so in their own time and at their own expense.
If I were of independent means I would make it my life's work to attempt to achieve just that.

CitizenPaine
The moving finger writes; and, having writ,
Moves on: nor all thy Piety nor Wit
Shall lure it back to cancel half a Line,
Nor all thy Tears wash out a Word of it.

From the Rubaiyat of Omar Khayyam (FitzGerald version)
Rincewind
Posts: 90
Joined: Sat Feb 03, 2007 7:08 pm

Post by Rincewind » Thu Mar 29, 2007 10:07 pm

Tony wrote

Men are more prone to disbelief I suppose. The risk takers. Any comments?
Martha wrote
Well, I am most decidedly an atheistic woman, but I've always felt I had very little in common with my fellow Irish women. As for my experience of Irish men, they do tend to be risk-takers, but in a reckless, materialistic (immature) way - not in the same way I (as a mother) would take a risk. I suppose what I'm saying here is, I consider myself a lot more adventurous that your average Irish woman Wink
Still can't understand woman, it is normally the more oppressed that rebel first. Looking at the ratio I think I'll have to move to sweden or norway.

Rincewind
FXR
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Location: Dublin

Post by FXR » Thu Mar 29, 2007 10:25 pm

CitizenPaine wrote:
zhollie wrote:I always maintain that if the progressive and rational elements of our society are to have any impact or undermine the influence of religion then we have to get ''god'' out of the schools. Those who desire religious instruction for their kids should do so in their own time and at their own expense.
If I were of independent means I would make it my life's work to attempt to achieve just that.

CitizenPaine
I've always been of the exact same mind. I could gladly spend hundreds of millions on ways to change this county without ever resorting to coercion. Simply by giving people a free choice we would be rid of the Vatican in a decade.
I'd build schools, fund research, sponsor independent tribunals of inquiry and launch a hundred court cases against the forces of darkness till there was steam rising from every dog collar in Ireland.

Gotta go I'm off to buy a ticket in the euro millions!
Human communication is a very rickety rope bridge between minds. Its too narrow to allow but a few thoughts to cross at a time. Many are lost in the chasms of noise, suspicion, misinterpretation and shooting the message through dislike of the messenger.
FXR
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Location: Dublin

Post by FXR » Thu Mar 29, 2007 10:43 pm

tony wrote:Roman Catholic (Male 1,818,390)(Female 1,863,056)
Church of Ireland (incl. Protestant) (Male 61,752) (Female 63,833)

Agnostic (Male 971) (Female 544)
Atheist (Male 641) (Female 288)
No religion (Male 110,756) (Female 75,562)

Interesting to see that for non-believers there are nearly twice as many men as women. Unlike most of the religions where the male female ratio is very close.

Men are more prone to disbelief I suppose. The risk takers. Any comments?

What the HELL is a "Lapsed Catholic" anyway. Am I a lapsed Santy Claus believer too? I dont like it. Its a negative Religious term.
A lapsed Catholic is someone who forgot they were a Catholic. It's a fudge Vatican PR word: its sounds better than sayin "no longer under our control".

How much worse (for the forces of darkness) would it sound if rephrased it to: people who no longer believe in the catholic church or who no longer follow catholic instructions.
Last edited by FXR on Mon Jun 11, 2007 9:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Human communication is a very rickety rope bridge between minds. Its too narrow to allow but a few thoughts to cross at a time. Many are lost in the chasms of noise, suspicion, misinterpretation and shooting the message through dislike of the messenger.
zhollie
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Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2007 12:34 pm

Re: Census 2006

Post by zhollie » Thu Mar 29, 2007 10:48 pm

Haymoon wrote:Table 35 has some peculiar features

1,515 persons are said to be agnostic, 929 atheist, 8,576 other stated religions and then 186,318 no religion.

Does this mean agnostics and atheists are considered by the CSO to have a religion :?: :?
People may not have a formal religion but still believe in a god of some sort. I wonder if there is a sizeable proportion of the people in the ''no religion'' category who misunderstand the difference between athism and no religion? I would say that there is. I simply cannot accept that such a hugh amount of people could purposefully declare that they have 'no religion'. What exactly are they saying? That they are Deists? They want the best of both worlds. A God they don't have to worship but one which absolves them of any need to think about the creation of the universe, religion or the number 42, as Douglas Adams would have it.

For many people, who do not take an active interest in all this, the word ''atheist'' like anarchicm, might come with a lot of negative connotations and misaprehensions and, therefore, people might be reticent about throwing their lot in with us?
FXR
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Location: Dublin

I see it crimson, I see it red..

Post by FXR » Thu Mar 29, 2007 11:01 pm

tony wrote:Roman Catholic (Male 1,818,390)(Female 1,863,056)
Church of Ireland (incl. Protestant) (Male 61,752) (Female 63,833)

Agnostic (Male 971) (Female 544)
Atheist (Male 641) (Female 288)
No religion (Male 110,756) (Female 75,562)
From Agnostic to No religion I make that total 188762 people.

As Haymoon pointed out there is a sharp rise in the figures for people who are no longer of a religious delusion.

There won't be any social upheaval any day soon but you have to put figures in context.



Put those numbers against the fact the Vatican controls the education of 98% of the population. They control the hospitals down to the naming of the wards the ethos the symbols hanging on the walls. They have the government working for them. They are practically the only outlet for births deaths and marriages being in a position to stifle the completion.

They have every tactical advantage possible and yet............people increasingly no longer believe their bullshit.

Battle has been joined...

I see it crimson, I see it red..
Human communication is a very rickety rope bridge between minds. Its too narrow to allow but a few thoughts to cross at a time. Many are lost in the chasms of noise, suspicion, misinterpretation and shooting the message through dislike of the messenger.
smiffy
Posts: 374
Joined: Thu Jan 18, 2007 11:58 pm

Re: Census 2006

Post by smiffy » Thu Mar 29, 2007 11:02 pm

zhollie wrote:
Haymoon wrote:Table 35 has some peculiar features

1,515 persons are said to be agnostic, 929 atheist, 8,576 other stated religions and then 186,318 no religion.

Does this mean agnostics and atheists are considered by the CSO to have a religion :?: :?
People may not have a formal religion but still believe in a god of some sort. I wonder if there is a sizeable proportion of the people in the ''no religion'' category who misunderstand the difference between athism and no religion? I would say that there is. I simply cannot accept that such a hugh amount of people could purposefully declare that they have 'no religion'. What exactly are they saying? That they are Deists? They want the best of both worlds. A God they don't have to worship but one which absolves them of any need to think about the creation of the universe, religion or the number 42, as Douglas Adams would have it.

For many people, who do not take an active interest in all this, the word ''atheist'' like anarchicm, might come with a lot of negative connotations and misaprehensions and, therefore, people might be reticent about throwing their lot in with us?
Actually, to understand the relatively small number of self-declared 'atheists' and 'agnostics' in the Census Results you need to look at the Census Form itself. The form, under the question 'What is your religion' only allowed for a small number of options to be chosen. Option 6 was 'Other', and if chosen, people were asked to specify. Option 7 was a tickbox saying 'No religion'.

The numbers of 'atheists' and 'agnostics' in the results represent only those who wrote down 'atheist' or 'agnostic' as a response to Option 6. Frankly, I think this displays a misunderstanding of what atheism actually means (it implies that it's actually a religious faith, on par with any other). I would have thought that the vast majority of atheists would have gone for the 'No religion' option. I know that's what I did.
Martha
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Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 8:47 pm

Post by Martha » Thu Mar 29, 2007 11:09 pm

CitizenPaine wrote: If I were of independent means I would make it my life's work to attempt to achieve just that.
You will never be of "independent means" that is, stand of your own two feet as the unique individual you are (unless you have been thoroughly cloned by your Irish Catholic upbringing - in which case, forget it) if you don't have the courage to assert yourself. That is, be a separate person in your own right.... which is a very difficult thing to do if your mother happens to be a life-long prisoner of Roman Catholicism :cry:
zhollie
Posts: 142
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2007 12:34 pm

Re: Census 2006

Post by zhollie » Thu Mar 29, 2007 11:11 pm

smiffy wrote:
zhollie wrote:
Haymoon wrote:Table 35 has some peculiar features

1,515 persons are said to be agnostic, 929 atheist, 8,576 other stated religions and then 186,318 no religion.

Does this mean agnostics and atheists are considered by the CSO to have a religion :?: :?
People may not have a formal religion but still believe in a god of some sort. I wonder if there is a sizeable proportion of the people in the ''no religion'' category who misunderstand the difference between athism and no religion? I would say that there is. I simply cannot accept that such a hugh amount of people could purposefully declare that they have 'no religion'. What exactly are they saying? That they are Deists? They want the best of both worlds. A God they don't have to worship but one which absolves them of any need to think about the creation of the universe, religion or the number 42, as Douglas Adams would have it.

For many people, who do not take an active interest in all this, the word ''atheist'' like anarchicm, might come with a lot of negative connotations and misaprehensions and, therefore, people might be reticent about throwing their lot in with us?
Actually, to understand the relatively small number of self-declared 'atheists' and 'agnostics' in the Census Results you need to look at the Census Form itself. The form, under the question 'What is your religion' only allowed for a small number of options to be chosen. Option 6 was 'Other', and if chosen, people were asked to specify. Option 7 was a tickbox saying 'No religion'.

The numbers of 'atheists' and 'agnostics' in the results represent only those who wrote down 'atheist' or 'agnostic' as a response to Option 6. Frankly, I think this displays a misunderstanding of what atheism actually means (it implies that it's actually a religious faith, on par with any other). I would have thought that the vast majority of atheists would have gone for the 'No religion' option. I know that's what I did.


'No religion' is too ambiguous. It could imply Deism. 'Atheism' is very clear cut and direct.
Martha
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Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 8:47 pm

Post by Martha » Thu Mar 29, 2007 11:18 pm

Rincewind wrote:
Still can't understand woman, it is normally the more oppressed that rebel first.
Not so. The most oppressed women are the ones who perpetuate the oppressive status quo that produced them. Clones breed clones....

Its the ones who are the least oppressed (damaged) who are the most effective in changing the system, because they are the true non-conformists. That's what brings the system down :wink:
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