Good and Evil

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EireannachforGod
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Re: Good and Evil

Post by EireannachforGod » Sun Mar 21, 2010 4:20 am

mind you now the fact that this perfect god -who makes no mistakes- felt the need to drown so many of his creations and start again somewhat negates against a perfect God don't you think?
GOd didn't confine his wrath to the people of Noah's time. God has proclaimed the death sentence upon all of sinful humanity. We all die because we have broken God's law. Every one of us is waiting on death row. Instead of standing in judgement over God, we need to judge ourselves according to the law of God. If we look we will see that we are guilty of a multitude of sins and therefore deserve to be punished. When we break civil law we get punished - how is it any different with god's law? Yet God, in his infinite mercy and graciousness, paid the penalty for our sins so we would not have to.
"The more I study nature the more I stand amazed at the work of the Creator. " Louis Pasteur

“Contemptuous of the faith of others, its proponents never doubt their own belief. They are fundamentalists.” Gary Wolf on the new atheists
chemicals
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Re: Good and Evil

Post by chemicals » Sun Mar 21, 2010 7:59 am

EireannachforGod wrote:
mind you now the fact that this perfect god -who makes no mistakes- felt the need to drown so many of his creations and start again somewhat negates against a perfect God don't you think?
GOd didn't confine his wrath to the people of Noah's time. God has proclaimed the death sentence upon all of sinful humanity. We all die because we have broken God's law. Every one of us is waiting on death row. Instead of standing in judgement over God, we need to judge ourselves according to the law of God. If we look we will see that we are guilty of a multitude of sins and therefore deserve to be punished. When we break civil law we get punished - how is it any different with god's law? Yet God, in his infinite mercy and graciousness, paid the penalty for our sins so we would not have to.
Preaching again ! why don't you answer the questions ?
والقس هو مجنون
Rev j.jones
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Re: Good and Evil

Post by Rev j.jones » Sun Mar 21, 2010 11:55 am

wonderfull progress Eírn
EireannachforGod wrote:If I were to insist that Chrsitians never sin I would be fooling myself entirely.
its great to see your time here has helped you grasp how easily fooled you are.
"The Meek a'int gonna inherit shit"
"I've got a hell of a lot of weapons to fight! I got my claws, I got cutlasses, I got guns, I got dynamite, I got a hell of a lot of fight! I will fight!" Rev Jones cured religion for 950 americans.
funkyderek
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Re: Good and Evil

Post by funkyderek » Sun Mar 21, 2010 5:04 pm

EireannachforGod wrote:Thanks. Give me a week.
I understand why it might take you a week to refute the challenges I have made, but you claimed the bible is full of prophecies that were fulfilled. Can't you just mention a few of those now? That way, by the time you come back with your response to the claims I made, I'll have a response to your claims.
I wouldn't be a Christian John if I didn't believe that [we all descended from Adam and Eve, around 4000 years ago]
(I'll assume you mean 6,000 years rather than the 4,000 someone else quoted, although that's only marginally less silly.)
This is quite an astonishing claim. You appear to be saying that in order to be a Christian one must believe that human life began some 9,000 years after the domestication of the dog, some 5,000 years after beer was first brewed and while the Sumerian civilisation was in full swing. As this is patently absurd, you must be claiming that only someone totally ignorant of history or someone irredeemably stupid can be a Christian. Few atheists would make such a strong claim so I'm amazed that a Christian would make it. Am I misinterpreting you somehow?
God has proclaimed the death sentence upon all of sinful humanity. We all die because we have broken God's law. Every one of us is waiting on death row. Instead of standing in judgement over God, we need to judge ourselves according to the law of God. If we look we will see that we are guilty of a multitude of sins and therefore deserve to be punished. When we break civil law we get punished - how is it any different with god's law?
The difference appears to be that in order to break civil law, one normally has to be aware of it and choose to break it. In order to break your god's law, however, it is apparently necessary only to exist. The punishment for the mere act of existing (a state nobody asked for that was inflicted on each of us by the self-same god) is eternal torture. Is that a correct summary of your beliefs?
Yet God, in his infinite mercy and graciousness, paid the penalty for our sins so we would not have to.
Mercy? Graciousness? I don't think those words mean what you think they mean. To whom did this god pay the penalty? And what was the penalty? Let me guess, he paid the penalty to himself and the payment consisted of him pretending to be a human and pretending to die. Am I close? Do you have any idea how ridiculous that is?
"Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has." - Margaret Mead

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Ygern
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Re: Good and Evil

Post by Ygern » Sun Mar 21, 2010 5:19 pm

Yet God, in his infinite mercy and graciousness, paid the penalty for our sins so we would not have to.
That's plain offensive. I've never done anything in my life to merit the death penalty - let alone the death penalty carried out on someone else in my stead.
The universe is huge and old, and rare things happen all the time ~ Lawrence Krauss
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Regens Küchl
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Re: Good and Evil

Post by Regens Küchl » Mon Mar 22, 2010 6:09 pm

funkyderek wrote:
EireannachforGod wrote:I wouldn't be a Christian John if I didn't believe that [we all descended from Adam and Eve, around 4000 years ago]
(I'll assume you mean 6,000 years rather than the 4,000 someone else quoted, although that's only marginally less silly.)
This is quite an astonishing claim. You appear to be saying that in order to be a Christian one must believe that human life began some 9,000 years after the domestication of the dog, some 5,000 years after beer was first brewed and while the Sumerian civilisation was in full swing. As this is patently absurd, you must be claiming that only someone totally ignorant of history or someone irredeemably stupid can be a Christian. Few atheists would make such a strong claim so I'm amazed that a Christian would make it. Am I misinterpreting you somehow?
EireannachforGod is a so called Young Earth Creationist :wink:
http://www.creationists.org/

And even one who says that all other Christians are no Christians :shock:

Not even Old Earth Creationists like Angelo are True Christians, according to EireannachforGod :arrow:
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=2300

I like that view - Angelo will be furious when I tell him :P
baroness
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Re: Good and Evil

Post by baroness » Mon Mar 22, 2010 9:47 pm

EireannachforGod wrote:If there is no God how does one determine what is good and what is evil?
Actually if you simply google "crime rates by religion" it seems that without god it is easier to determine what is good and what is evil.

Based on simple logic and reasoning, what benefits the group, benefits the individual, therefore it is in the individuals interest to be a productive member of society and not upset the group, following the laws, rules and beliefs regarding right and wrong of the culture they are brought up in. The consequence of doing evil is ostracization from the group.

God, while teaching of sins also teaches forgiveness and repentance, essentially any sin or evil will be forgiven if you repent, without any punishment. While there is the consequence of hell, most if not all people of any faith believe that if you repent your sins are forgiven, providing no true incentive not to sin or commit evil.
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mkaobrih
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Re: Good and Evil

Post by mkaobrih » Mon Mar 22, 2010 10:07 pm

EireannachforGod wrote:
Or do you really believe that we all descended from Adam and Eve, around 4000 years ago?
I wouldn't be a Christian John if I didn't believe that.
Must’ve been a lot of incest going on there then.
The church complains of persecution when it's not allowed to persecute.
Ygern
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Re: Good and Evil

Post by Ygern » Mon Mar 22, 2010 10:30 pm

mkaobrih wrote: Must’ve been a lot of incest going on there then.
Funny you should say that :)

http://listverse.com/2008/05/26/top-6-i ... the-bible/

One could argue that Cain maybe didn't "marry" his sister. But if he didn't marry his sister , then Adam & Eve are not the parents of all humanity because at least 50% of the human race comes from the fabled Land of Nod (Genesis 4:16).

However Creationists insist that this is not the case, and the God sanctions incest wholeheartedly

Or: (all credits to http://www.blaghag.com/ )

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_-dxg8gReUqE/S ... um+041.jpg
The universe is huge and old, and rare things happen all the time ~ Lawrence Krauss
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EireannachforGod
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Re: Good and Evil

Post by EireannachforGod » Tue Mar 23, 2010 8:14 am

Can't you just mention a few of those now?
The Jews would survive Babylonian rule and return home
Bible prophecy found in Jeremiah 32:36-37
Prophecy written sometime between 626-586 BC
Prophecy fulfilled in 536 BC

The people of Israel would return to "their own land"
Bible prophecy found in Ezekiel 34:13
Prophecy written between 593-571 BC
Prophecy fulfilled around 2600 years ago

The people of Israel will never be completely destroyed
Bible prophecy found in Leviticus 26:44
Prophecy written as early as 1400 BC
Prophecy fulfilled throughout history

I'be back to you soon on Ezekiel 26. What I've read only strengthens my faith in the bible as God's infallible word and revelation to mankind.
"The more I study nature the more I stand amazed at the work of the Creator. " Louis Pasteur

“Contemptuous of the faith of others, its proponents never doubt their own belief. They are fundamentalists.” Gary Wolf on the new atheists
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