De-Baptism

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Martha
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Post by Martha » Fri Jun 22, 2007 1:26 pm

bipedalhumanoid wrote:Imagine the message that would send to my family.
Exactly. Who is more important (relevant) to you? Your family or the Vatican?
Eternity is a very long time, especially towards the end.

Woody Allen
bipedalhumanoid
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Post by bipedalhumanoid » Fri Jun 22, 2007 1:29 pm

Easy Steps to Excommunication

http://www.atheistfoundation.org.au/excommunication.htm


The Church's criteria for meriting excommunication

The church is patronizing to atheists. They can easily recognize another superstition, but, being unfamiliar with rationality, they have difficulty accepting the decision to renounce all mumbo jumbo. They have, however, officially established these criteria for judging all cases of excommunication: You must ACT. Mere thought is not enough. You should be able to cite memberships in freethought and humanist groups. You should be able to cite actions you have taken, such as, letters written, demonstrations attended, meetings attended, magazine subscriptions, etc. As well as negative actions, like not attending church, not giving them any money, time or thought for years. You must be PERSISTENT. This must take place over a long period of time. If at first you don't succeed...Cite long commitment, and keep trying and keep writing. You must be CONTUMACIOUS. As in: I am firm, you are contumacious, he is pig-headed. Do not waver or indicate any hesitation. It is not necessary to be impolite, but do not be unclear in your condemnation of Catholicism in order to avoid offence. You must be AWARE that this involves excommunication. For them, ignorance of canon law is an excuse. State in your letter that you are aware of this, that you know what the consequences are and that this is what you wish to happen. You have to BE A ROMAN CATHOLIC. Obviously. In your letter, make them aware of this by telling them the parish where you were baptised and the date. Many people, hoping for some kind of heresy cachet, have inquired about getting excommunciated, even though they are not currently memebers of a church. No, you can't.

THEY HAVE A DUTY to other Roman Catholics

Your mental state is something that no one knows except you. You are the only expert on your own non-religious status. They have a duty to inform other Roman Catholics about this change in you so that they do not mishandle their dealings with you. In terms of marriage, communion, death and so on, you should be treated as a non-Catholic. If they fail to do this, they are not dealing fairly with the Catholics in their charge. So far, most cases have gone smoothly. Using the citations in this article seems to impress them with the idea that you are serious, you know what you are talking about, and that this is not a "spur or the moment" whim. If, however, you meet resistance, there is some heavier ammunition below. Fill out the handy form below and send it in to your local priest. This may only get things started. Be prepared to continue for a long time. Remember: each person who does this makes it easier for the next person.




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I am an atheist.

I hereby renounce all the trappings of religion.

I renounce all blessings, benefits, graces, sanctifications, and advantages supposedly conferred on me by any religion or by any religious act done by me or on my behalf in the past, present or future.

I condemn as monstrous the idea of original sin, and renounce any baptism done on my behalf to wash it away.

I reject as ridiculous the idea of an atoning sacrifice and spurn its presumed benefits.

I do not believe that any god, supernatural realm or afterlife exists, and will not act as if they did.

I do not believe that any book, building, place, person, thing or action is holy and will not pretend that they are.

I do not think that praying is anything more than talking to oneself and will not make believe that it is.

I do not believe that any person is more sanctified than any other, or that any human being should be elevated above another in any way, due to ancestry, race, gender, occupation, belief or for any other reason and will not feign that I do.

As a principled and rational person, it pains me that someone, somewhere may be counting me as an adherent of an irrational superstition which has done and is doing irreparable harm to humanity and with which I profoundly disagree. Please remove my name from the records of the church, and record that I am no longer a Roman Catholic. Please send me confirmation of this action. Please do this as soon as possible.


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bipedalhumanoid
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Post by bipedalhumanoid » Fri Jun 22, 2007 1:31 pm

Martha wrote:
bipedalhumanoid wrote:Imagine the message that would send to my family.
Exactly. Who is more important (relevant) to you? Your family or the Vatican?
My family. That's exactly why I'd like them to think twice before they go around indoctrinating other members of my family into this cult.
Martha
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Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 8:47 pm

Post by Martha » Fri Jun 22, 2007 1:33 pm

Gar wrote:I think it's important to let them know that there are people who don't want to be part of their club.
They already know that. The people have voted with their feet: the seminaries are practically empty nowadays, and only a fraction of the populace attend church anymore (they go shopping instead :lol: ) What more proof do they need? :roll:
Eternity is a very long time, especially towards the end.

Woody Allen
zhollie
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Post by zhollie » Fri Jun 22, 2007 1:41 pm

The only way a de-baptism would be of any use would be if it were performed in a very humourous and public manner and with the intent of ridiculing the church and it's beliefs, otherwise it would appear more like an exorcism. Really, there is no need for all the theatrics just to prove a point. The less interaction with the church the better and that includes so called de-baptisims.
Gar
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Post by Gar » Fri Jun 22, 2007 1:41 pm

Thanks for those links bipedalhumanoid,
I really liked that guide to getting excommunicated, especially their letter.
I have to say though I'm not really that angry about being baptised, as I explained to my Ma yesterday she was only doing what she thought was right at the time. It's more to state clearly to the catholic church that I disagree strongly with their beliefs and their policies particularly their attitude towards women, homosexuals and people in Africa (the whole no condoms thing).
bipedalhumanoid
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Post by bipedalhumanoid » Fri Jun 22, 2007 1:41 pm

Martha wrote:
Gar wrote:I think it's important to let them know that there are people who don't want to be part of their club.
They already know that. The people have voted with their feet: the seminaries are practically empty nowadays, and only a fraction of the populace attend church anymore (they go shopping instead :lol: ) What more proof do they need? :roll:
That's exactly why they have to inflate their numbers BY COUNTING ME!
Martha
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Post by Martha » Fri Jun 22, 2007 2:26 pm

bipedalhumanoid wrote:In Ireland the non-religious are being forced to get their kids baptised or they risk not being able to find school places. That absolutely sucks and that's another reason to excommunicate as an adult.
Then its up to those parents to go to the government and insist on their right not to be forced to do anything by any group! That's why we elect a government. We didn't elect the Catholic Church to run our health and education systems. Its about time the Irish people (en masse) woke up!
Eternity is a very long time, especially towards the end.

Woody Allen
Martha
Posts: 1084
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 8:47 pm

Post by Martha » Fri Jun 22, 2007 2:32 pm

bipedalhumanoid wrote:
My family. That's exactly why I'd like them to think twice before they go around indoctrinating other members of my family into this cult.
With respect, people who feel the need to go around indoctrinating others (which is to say, controlling the lives of others) - whether family members or not - don't do much actual thinking :o
Eternity is a very long time, especially towards the end.

Woody Allen
Martha
Posts: 1084
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 8:47 pm

Post by Martha » Fri Jun 22, 2007 2:35 pm

bipedalhumanoid wrote:
That's exactly why they have to inflate their numbers BY COUNTING ME!
Look, they are DELUDED! They've always been (and always will be) deluded. So why are you taking them so seriously????
Eternity is a very long time, especially towards the end.

Woody Allen
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