Muslims engage with PZ Myers and Dawkins at conference

General discussions
alevel18
Posts: 1
Joined: Tue Jun 07, 2011 12:17 pm

Muslims engage with PZ Myers and Dawkins at conference

Post by alevel18 » Tue Jun 07, 2011 12:25 pm

Hi all,

For those who missed the Atheists Conference last week, a group of Muslims attended the event. We were all very annoyed by them being there but in fairness they were very polite and non confrontational. One of the guys, Humza i think his name was, even got a round of applause for his 2 minute speech at one of the talks. Apparently he came from an atheist, humanist background before he became a muslim.

Youtube videos below:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3T5Pm7qLH50

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N4trHH6AuZ0

The muslims were from iERA (Islamic education and research academy), i think. They had a few discussions with Prof. PZ Myers & Richard Dawkins at the World Atheist Convention.
funkyderek
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 373
Joined: Mon Feb 26, 2007 4:54 pm
Location: Dublin, Ireland
Contact:

Re: Muslims engage with PZ Myers and Dawkins at conference

Post by funkyderek » Tue Jun 07, 2011 1:58 pm

Heh. Obvious Muslim is obvious. But thanks for posting the links anyway
alevel18 wrote:For those who missed the Atheists Conference last week, a group of Muslims attended the event.
Islamists, to be more precise.
We were all very annoyed by them being there
In general, we weren't and I'm certain you weren't.
but in fairness they were very polite and non confrontational.
For the most part. Hamza Tzortzis was particularly confrontational, and dishonest in his realtime reporting of the event.
One of the guys, Humza i think his name was, even got a round of applause for his 2 minute speech at one of the talks.
The only time I recall Hamza getting any applause was after his rather weaselly apology for his misrepresentation of Dawkins' views the previous day which he followed by thanking the conference organisers and attendees for their hospitality and friendliness.
Apparently he came from an atheist, humanist background before he became a muslim.
Well, I'm sure you'd know more about that than we would.
The muslims were from iERA (Islamic education and research academy), i think.
Even if you weren't one of their supporters, that's in the title of their video.
They had a few discussions with Prof. PZ Myers & Richard Dawkins at the World Atheist Convention.
The video you posted contains pretty much the entirety of their encounters. The only other one of significance was Dawkins responding to Hamza's ignorant question about chance and design http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TAyZaSI- ... ture=share
"Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has." - Margaret Mead

Image

Image Image Image Image
Marks
Atheist Ireland Member
Atheist Ireland Member
Posts: 362
Joined: Mon Sep 07, 2009 12:09 pm

Re: Muslims engage with PZ Myers and Dawkins at conference

Post by Marks » Tue Jun 07, 2011 2:00 pm

Who is ‘we were all very annoyed’. We were not as they paid their money like everyone else.

Remember this was a Conference for Atheists and was not as is claimed in this video solely to communicate Atheism to the world. I could make the charge that Islamists attended a Conference for Atheists simply to seek publicity for themselves and pretended then that the Conference was solely to communicate Atheism to the world. Claiming that the sole purpose of the Conference was to communicate Atheism gives the impression that they had a legitimate reason to attend the Conference which according to them was to positively and intellectually engage with Atheists.

They then went onto say that Prof PZ Myers was requested to positively and intellectually engage with Hamza Andreas Tzortzis and when the Professor did not reply they had to approach him outside the Conference. They also stated that PZ Myers is widely regarded as confrontational which gives the impression that despite this he was afraid to speak to Hamza Andreas Tzortzis and poor old Hamza had no option but to engage him outside the Conference “why don’t you speak to me” he said. This of course gives the impression that Atheists and in particular PZ Myers did not want to positively and intellectually engage with them because they were not up to it. They already were well aware that this Conference was not the place for that engagement.

They also give the impression they were allowed to speak to the audience which again puts a different slant on the whole proceedings. Only the speakers spoke to the audience everyone else asked questions and got an answer which included them. They only said this because it gives the impression that they had a purpose in attending besides self publicity. For example they state that Adnan Rashid was allowed to comment on what Maryam Namazie said in her speech. That is not how it happened as he was like everyone else was permitted to ask a question. He got an answer as well and I notice that they conveniently left that out of their video. They also left out the answer Richard Dawkins gave to one of their questions and they did film both answers. Some very careful editing going on there and the purpose of that is to pretend to their audience that they achieved something by attending the Conference and that they are of some importance. If you call that polite and non-confrontational then we are obviously not speaking the same language.
Beebub
Atheist Ireland Member
Atheist Ireland Member
Posts: 1014
Joined: Mon Jul 13, 2009 1:22 pm

Re: Muslims engage with PZ Myers and Dawkins at conference

Post by Beebub » Tue Jun 07, 2011 2:25 pm

Yes, I didn't get the impression of everyone 'being annoyed'.

I agree very much with Marks. It was interesting that they chose to leave out Maryam's reply to his question. I'm paraphrasing so if anyone has a better memory of what she said, please clarify. But she said that these guys are well trained to come accross as the reasonable face of Islam, where in reality nothing has changed behind the scenes and Islam and Sharia Law are as vicious and vindictive as ever. She encouraged the audience to engage with them and to ask the directly about what Sharia Law has to say about stoning and the fact that a woman's testimony is worth half of a man's in a Sharia court. She said that if we did, we would not get a straight answer.

Someone spoke from the floor then to say that he did confront them on the issue of stoning in Sharia Law and did not get a straight answer.

Funkyderek then tweeted them and asked a direct question on the issue of stoning in Sharia Law and Hamza replied by saying that the Koran fobids the taking of drugs and so Islamists don't get stoned. So he had a chance to directly answer the question in the middle of the conference and decided to make a stupid joke.

Quite aside from that, it was my distinct impression that part of their agenda was to have a block of them at the back of the room with video and sound equipment to somehow try and intimidate Maryam. Well it didn't work. She owned them!
funkyderek
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 373
Joined: Mon Feb 26, 2007 4:54 pm
Location: Dublin, Ireland
Contact:

Re: Muslims engage with PZ Myers and Dawkins at conference

Post by funkyderek » Tue Jun 07, 2011 2:31 pm

I'm guessing that alevel18 was not one of the five Islamists who were there, and is only relying on second-hand information.
While I know it's acceptable for Muslims to lie to unbelievers in order to further their cause it's pretty stupid not to make up a new username.

See http://www.searchtick.com/video/video/W ... ramme.html for this comment:
alevel18 Says:

Feb 2, 2011 - I must say, i was very impressed by the recent iERA event. Their work is very inspirational. This video is a good demonstration on 'how to give dawah'. Thumbs up from me :-)
"Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has." - Margaret Mead

Image

Image Image Image Image
Tulip1
Atheist Ireland Member
Atheist Ireland Member
Posts: 1529
Joined: Sat Aug 08, 2009 1:07 pm
Location: Sligo

Re: Muslims engage with PZ Myers and Dawkins at conference

Post by Tulip1 » Tue Jun 07, 2011 2:42 pm

I certainly was not anoyed and thought they were very well spoken and think they added to the conference rather then disrupting it.

The woman of the ex muslims gave them a proper ear bashing!

I think someone put that on hamza's facebook page.
Pope says atheists pick & choose their morals. Correct. Today I will be frowning on child abuse & not having a problem with homosexuality.
paolovf
Atheist Ireland Member
Atheist Ireland Member
Posts: 257
Joined: Sun Apr 24, 2011 3:58 pm

Re: Muslims engage with PZ Myers and Dawkins at conference

Post by paolovf » Tue Jun 07, 2011 3:51 pm

I have to say I found it extremely frustrating to listen to the persistent babble from these islamists. I'd go further to say I disagree with them that this type of conversation is useful - it's boring.
Marks
Atheist Ireland Member
Atheist Ireland Member
Posts: 362
Joined: Mon Sep 07, 2009 12:09 pm

Re: Muslims engage with PZ Myers and Dawkins at conference

Post by Marks » Tue Jun 07, 2011 4:26 pm

funkyderek wrote:I'm guessing that alevel18 was not one of the five Islamists who were there, and is only relying on second-hand information.
While I know it's acceptable for Muslims to lie to unbelievers in order to further their cause it's pretty stupid not to make up a new username.

See http://www.searchtick.com/video/video/W ... ramme.html for this comment:
Love that funkyderek, thought as much myself.
Tulip1
Atheist Ireland Member
Atheist Ireland Member
Posts: 1529
Joined: Sat Aug 08, 2009 1:07 pm
Location: Sligo

Re: Muslims engage with PZ Myers and Dawkins at conference

Post by Tulip1 » Tue Jun 07, 2011 4:45 pm

paolovf wrote:
I have to say I found it extremely frustrating to listen to the persistent babble from these islamists. I'd go further to say I disagree with them that this type of conversation is useful - it's boring.
I thought AI had hired them as entertainment. I didn't think it was boring at all when maryam gave them an earbashing. Very entertaining.
Pope says atheists pick & choose their morals. Correct. Today I will be frowning on child abuse & not having a problem with homosexuality.
paolovf
Atheist Ireland Member
Atheist Ireland Member
Posts: 257
Joined: Sun Apr 24, 2011 3:58 pm

Re: Muslims engage with PZ Myers and Dawkins at conference

Post by paolovf » Tue Jun 07, 2011 5:03 pm

Tulip1 wrote:I thought AI had hired them as entertainment. I didn't think it was boring at all when maryam gave them an earbashing. Very entertaining.
Unfortunately I was unable to attend the convention but I did watch the whole video given by the OP, so even if I did say it bored me I guess, yes, I did enjoy seeing Myers and Dawkins coming out on top!

I haven't seen any footage of their exchange with Maryam Namazie, if anyone has a link please share.
Post Reply