Credit Union Prayer

Discuss church-state separation issues that are relevant in Ireland.
globulin77
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Re: Credit Union Prayer

Post by globulin77 » Sun Nov 18, 2012 3:47 pm

paddie wrote:During the week I attended my local Credit Union AGM. As this was the first for three years there were around 380 local people there. At the start of the meeting we were asked to rise for the Credit Union Prayer. My reaction was to remain seated which I did. As I was toward the front of the venue I was not aware of anyone else remaining seated. I fail to see the need for a Christian prayer to be said at an event which has no relationship to religion. If people wise to pray go to church or their home but not a community event in a public venue. I felt my secular beliefs were being over ridden and excluded. During the next few days I have raised the event with others to seek their views on the prayer and most said they just rose and went along with it. I will be writing to my local credit union about the prayer being said at the AGM. I will also be seeking information from the League of Credit Unions on the issue. Could anyone advice me on this issue or is this a common event. Thank you.
The first Agm for three years!!! I laughed when I read that. Apologies if I seem flippant.
Good to hear you backed up your stance with action....Fair play to you.
aZerogodist
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Re: Credit Union Prayer

Post by aZerogodist » Sun Dec 02, 2012 2:18 pm

Paddie, well done for standing you ground. They at least could of given the option to go out for a cig while they did they're prayer, but wouldn't the national anthem make more sense, or even a musician giving a song to liven up the event, rather than a depressive prayer. god things are depressive enough without a prayer !
paddie
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Re: Credit Union Prayer

Post by paddie » Thu Dec 06, 2012 8:58 pm

Up to 6th December I have received no correspondence from the Credit Union. On the 7th December I will hand into the Credit Union a letter addressed to the Complaints Committee making them aware of my grievance and the non reply from the Complaints Officer. I am following the complaints process that was outlined at the start of the Post Subject. As you can see this may take some time to go through the complaints process and longer if the Credit Union fails to respond to my letters. However I feel a clear paper trail is the valid route to go, also the more people that are aware of the complaint further into the organisation ie directors when/if I get that far the more qestions will be asked as to why the complaint was not delt with at the start of the process. Slow but sure.
paddie
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Re: Credit Union Prayer

Post by paddie » Mon Jan 07, 2013 9:15 pm

Around mid December I received a reply to my complaint. The main points of the reply were that the Directors of the Credit Union were united in the use of the Credit Union prayer being said at the start of all Credit Union meetings. They were following the World Council of Credit Union practise in the use of the prayer. They would still stand for the prayer if others choose to or not. My other points were not raised in the reply.
Another point of note is that my Credit Union does not have a Complaints Officer or a Complaint committee.
bipedalhumanoid
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Re: Credit Union Prayer

Post by bipedalhumanoid » Tue Jan 08, 2013 11:54 am

Very curious that an organisation would voluntarily alienate some of its own members in this way. I recently joined my local credit union. Will have to make a point to attend the next general meeting myself.
"The fact of your own existence is the most astonishing fact you will ever have to face. Don’t you ever get used to it." - Richard Dawkins... being shrill and offensive again I suppose.
paddie
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Re: Credit Union Prayer

Post by paddie » Mon Jan 14, 2013 7:27 pm

Have today replyed to the Credit Union responce to my complaint. As there is no complaints officer/committee within the Credit Union I have addressed my complain back to the Directors. My main point is that they did not deal with the issues of my complaint.

1. The AGM turned into a faith based event by the inclusion of the Christian prayer.
2. Credit Unions should not discrminate on the grounds of religious profession, belief or status.
3. The Credit Union should not promote a religious prayer and there by exclude other beliefs.
4. What is the standing of members/employees in relation to not being able due to their beliefs to stand for the prayer.
5. THe AGM was a meeting of members not a religious event.
6. The Credit Union should not seek to convert its members by the promotion of prayer.

If there is no responce to this letter, I will seek to make use of the League of Credit Unions complains process.

I feel that the Credit Union can stonewall this complaint bacause I am one member. If the Atheist within the location were seen as a group, the Credit Union would have a more difficult time defending that which is undefendable. How can a Credit Union ask members to stand for a lot of words that have no relationship to the meeting. Employees must be put in an unfair position in regards to their employers promotion of the prayer. As a final point if anyone has any information in regard to the League of Irelands Credit Union complaints process I would like to know. Thank you - Paddie
Tulip1
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Re: Credit Union Prayer

Post by Tulip1 » Tue Jan 15, 2013 7:04 pm

Maybe emphasize that the non-religious are the second largest group and growing.
Pope says atheists pick & choose their morals. Correct. Today I will be frowning on child abuse & not having a problem with homosexuality.
paddie
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Re: Credit Union Prayer

Post by paddie » Wed Jan 16, 2013 9:15 pm

In my first letter setting out the complaint I pointed out that non religious people formed the largest minority in the state. The reply from the Credit Union did not touch upon the points I layed out. The reply was we (committee) think the prayer is a good idea and if you and others do not want to stand for it that's ok with us because we are going to carry on anyway.
My reply to the Credit Union non reply has been given into the Credit Union and I'm sure that there will be a reply within 3 or 4 weeks going by their past responce. Will have to go through the local process before moving on.

As I see it, the complaint really has to move to the Irish League of Credit Unions. Not sure the ILoCU will be willing to deal with my complaint but will give it a go and see what comes up.
chemicals
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Re: Credit Union Prayer

Post by chemicals » Thu Jan 17, 2013 1:36 pm

fuck it tell them your a muslim and offended and they will drop it like a hot rock :D
والقس هو مجنون
Tulip1
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Re: Credit Union Prayer

Post by Tulip1 » Thu Jan 17, 2013 9:33 pm

paddie wrote:In my first letter setting out the complaint I pointed out that non religious people formed the largest minority in the state. The reply from the Credit Union did not touch upon the points I layed out. The reply was we (committee) think the prayer is a good idea and if you and others do not want to stand for it that's ok with us because we are going to carry on anyway.
My reply to the Credit Union non reply has been given into the Credit Union and I'm sure that there will be a reply within 3 or 4 weeks going by their past responce. Will have to go through the local process before moving on.

As I see it, the complaint really has to move to the Irish League of Credit Unions. Not sure the ILoCU will be willing to deal with my complaint but will give it a go and see what comes up.
I am really eager to know how they will react. Keep us posted!!
Pope says atheists pick & choose their morals. Correct. Today I will be frowning on child abuse & not having a problem with homosexuality.
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