Suicide in Ireland, Are we doing Enough?

Discuss Irish and International politics
bipedalhumanoid
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Re: Suicide in Ireland, Are we doing Enough?

Post by bipedalhumanoid » Tue Jan 24, 2012 7:38 pm

Feardorcha wrote:I take on board what you say but I can think of no other word to go with suicide, other than commit. 'Take one's own life' or 'kill oneself' are equally harsh. Of course 'commit' doesn't only apply to crime but that is probably its origin in this case.
I hear them say on Raidio na Gaeltachta 'chug sé lámh in a bháis féin' - he took a hand in his own death.
I've been wrecking my head trying to recall the terms suggested as an alternative. Looking online, I can see that as a consciousness raising exercise, it's clearly in its infancy. Most references to suicide use the term "commit".

I did find this though, which explains it better than I can...
http://www.spanidaho.org/stigma.shtml

They suggest terms like "completed suicide" or "died by suicide".
Language Considerations Related to Suicide

“The difference between the almost right word and the right word is really a large matter – it’s the difference between the lightening bug and the lightening.” - Mark Twain

The language we use can make a significant difference in reducing stigma. It is vital that we begin to use, and educate others to use, terms other than “commit suicide.” “Commit suicide” connotes criminal or sinful behavior which reinforces stigma. There are better alternatives.

Use this language:

"Died by suicide"
"Completed suicide"

Avoid this language:

Committed suicide
Successful suicide
"The fact of your own existence is the most astonishing fact you will ever have to face. Don’t you ever get used to it." - Richard Dawkins... being shrill and offensive again I suppose.
Tulip1
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Re: Suicide in Ireland, Are we doing Enough?

Post by Tulip1 » Tue Jan 24, 2012 7:56 pm

We call it self dead/death.
Pope says atheists pick & choose their morals. Correct. Today I will be frowning on child abuse & not having a problem with homosexuality.
Feardorcha
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Re: Suicide in Ireland, Are we doing Enough?

Post by Feardorcha » Tue Jan 24, 2012 9:48 pm

I've heard 'he ended his own life' or 'he took his own life'.
chemicals
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Re: Suicide in Ireland, Are we doing Enough?

Post by chemicals » Tue Jan 24, 2012 10:34 pm

Feardorcha wrote:I've heard 'he ended his own life' or 'he took his own life'.
yeah heard those a lot in Dubkin
-or "he did away with himself" usually followed by " the poor lad/crater/fucker"
والقس هو مجنون
Beebub
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Re: Suicide in Ireland, Are we doing Enough?

Post by Beebub » Wed Jan 25, 2012 1:03 pm

I've heard representatives of suicide related organisations on radio saying 'took their own life' is acceptable and also that 'commiting' should be avoided. Here's a section from the Samaritans Ireland website in their media section:
Use phrases like
• A suicide
• Die by suicide
• Take one’s own life
• A suicide attempt
• A completed suicide
• Person at risk of suicide
• Help prevent suicide

Avoid phrases like
• A successful suicide attempt
• An unsuccessful suicide attempt
• Commit suicide. (Suicide is now decriminalised so
it is better not to talk about ‘committing suicide’ but
use ‘take one's life’, or ‘die by suicide’ instead.)
• Suicide victim
• Just a cry for help
• Suicide-prone person
• Stop the spread/epidemic of suicide
• Suicide ‘tourist’
http://www.samaritans.org/pdf/IrishMedi ... es2009.pdf

And I don't think it's 'PC'. It's a very serious issue and one which still has a stigma attached, as does mental health issue in general. If we were more open about the whole issue we might be able to prevent some people doing this. It might seem a simple enough idea, but by not using 'commit', it might slowly help to reduce the stigma attached and may make more families who lost loved ones talk more openly about it, which may in turn help other families who are currently going through something similar with a family member and may be of help and may help prevent more deaths.
paolovf
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Re: Suicide in Ireland, Are we doing Enough?

Post by paolovf » Tue Jan 31, 2012 4:49 pm

A guide to dealing with suicide in the workplace was launched today by the Irish Hospice Foundation and Console:

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0131/suicide.html
Feardorcha
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Re: Suicide in Ireland, Are we doing Enough?

Post by Feardorcha » Tue Jan 31, 2012 4:57 pm

There are many organisations listed in that publication that work to prevent suicide but is there no organisation in Ireland to help people who choose suicide?
Beebub
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Re: Suicide in Ireland, Are we doing Enough?

Post by Beebub » Tue Jan 31, 2012 5:33 pm

Feardorcha wrote:There are many organisations listed in that publication that work to prevent suicide but is there no organisation in Ireland to help people who choose suicide?
No chance. While it's not illegal to attept or carry out suicide, it is illegal to aid and abet. Where the line is drawn, as far as I'm aware is grey. If a person is in a wheelchair, say and can't reach the cupboard with their drugs, is a person aiding and abetting by giving them their pills so that they can take too many? I'm not sure the answer to that is known. I did hear of people who were stopped at the airport by gardai who were planning to travel to Switzerland and the person accompanying the person intending to end their life with dignity was warned that she could be prosecuted on return; this is anecdotal, however and I can't remember where I read it.
Dev
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Re: Suicide in Ireland, Are we doing Enough?

Post by Dev » Thu Feb 02, 2012 2:33 pm

Beebub wrote: I did hear of people who were stopped at the airport by gardai who were planning to travel to Switzerland and the person accompanying the person intending to end their life with dignity was warned that she could be prosecuted on return; this is anecdotal, however and I can't remember where I read it.
This would seem very very harsh - I don't see how it could hold in reality. I mean for example we can travel to Amsterdam and smoke a J and not be prosecuted on return because we haven't broken any laws anywhere.

The only thing I can think of would be a European law that says you can't aid such a person . . . and even still the Swiss aren't in the EU!
bipedalhumanoid
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Re: Suicide in Ireland, Are we doing Enough?

Post by bipedalhumanoid » Thu Feb 02, 2012 3:49 pm

Dev wrote:
This would seem very very harsh - I don't see how it could hold in reality. I mean for example we can travel to Amsterdam and smoke a J and not be prosecuted on return because we haven't broken any laws anywhere.
That's a bad analogy. In the case of accompanying a terminally ill patient onto an air craft and helping them get to a country where they will end their life, you HAVE done something illegal in Ireland. By helping them get to the airport you've assisted in their suicide, while you were on Irish soil.

Also, there is at least one precedent I know of where a person can be convicted in one country of something they did in another country... even when that activity is not illegal in the country in which it occured.

An Australian citizen or resident can be convicted with statutory rape for having sex with a person under the age of 16, even if the offence took place in another country, and even if age of consent laws in that country permit it (ie. age of consent is lower than 16).
"The fact of your own existence is the most astonishing fact you will ever have to face. Don’t you ever get used to it." - Richard Dawkins... being shrill and offensive again I suppose.
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