Muslim Public Affairs Committee

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Irish Shaman
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Re: Muslim Public Affairs Committee

Post by Irish Shaman » Wed Aug 05, 2009 1:25 pm

Still you know, we all have to band together in these times.

Those crazy kids over there have to be kept watch over, first they'll try and make a website, then they'll try and start a campaign, and then what? Suggest seperate graveyards!?!?

...oh...


Really though, to think *we* should give a shit about whether or not *we* don't want graves for other minorities in our country. Why try and start a fuss over something like that with us? Why not just go to some catholic forum(I've heard they know technology now) - and get riled up there?
It's not like we have an active say in what changes are made to public or private graveyards.

It's not like I'm against everything to do with the word "Muslim" or "Christian". Go have your graves and clothing that is rediculous to wear on summer days, either way I'm not pushed.
*COUGH* SHAMELESSPLUG *COUGH*
http://www.youtube.com/1rishShaman

Atheism, Atheist Ireland, Gaming, The Atheist Experience... what more could you want?
nozzferrahhtoo
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Re: Muslim Public Affairs Committee

Post by nozzferrahhtoo » Wed Aug 05, 2009 1:57 pm

I too do not see the use of singling out one person, his one blog or even one religion.

There are more important people to worry about in Ireland north and south at the moment, like members of the DUP trying to argue for having creationism in schools. I am more worried about people in actual elected government than I am with one man and his blog. I am more concerned with religion per se rather than any particular religion.

All requests from these people, or any people, should be individually considered secularly on their merits, not based on who is saying it. There is not one utterance from MPAC, or anyone else for that matter, for which we are required to reference their religion to debunk.

For example head scarves for the police? No thanks. Not because we are anti Muslim, or secular, or atheist, but merely because it’s a bad idea. The uniform must be standardised and not changeable from person to person. The uniform should not impede the ability to do their job effectively and a scarf or veil which impedes vision does just that.

We can knock ideas like this without even referencing that it’s a Muslim or MPAC request. It is just basically a stupid idea from the ground up with zero benefit and much damage.

Singleing out MPAC, his website or his blog achieves nothing and just gives him exposure and web traffic. I have never once followed a link to his site or typed in the url, nor shall I ever.

Let him bring his arguments to us where we can deal with them. Lets not go to him, especially if his tactic appears to be to sign up to this website as doppelganger and P.ie as alterego and who knows what other sites with other names which are all words, the meaning of which is highlighting the double identity he intends to use to give himself credibility.
Tulip1
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Re: Muslim Public Affairs Committee

Post by Tulip1 » Mon Aug 10, 2009 8:27 am

nozzferrahhtoo wrote:I too do not see the use of singling out one person, his one blog or even one religion.

All requests from these people, or any people, should be individually considered secularly on their merits, not based on who is saying it. There is not one utterance from MPAC, or anyone else for that matter, for which we are required to reference their religion to debunk.
The problem is that we (or better maybe I) see al religions as one and the same thing, so I would agree with you from 'our' point of view. Fact is that religious people think their religion is very different from the next one.

That's why you end up fighting each religion seperatly. We have to fight the bible and the koran, the only have to ridicule the non believer in which the can catagorice everyone that is not agreeing with them.

We had that in Holland, where there are a lot of atheists. We finaly got the christians cornered and then we get the muslims doing it all over again (we have 1 million muslims in Holland) this resulted in a counter reaction so now we have the christen democrats and the reformed party running our country for the past 8 years. They do their best to bring Holland back to the 50's at the moment.

What I try to say is you are right but in reallity you will find out that this is really hard.
Pope says atheists pick & choose their morals. Correct. Today I will be frowning on child abuse & not having a problem with homosexuality.
Irish Shaman
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Re: Muslim Public Affairs Committee

Post by Irish Shaman » Tue Aug 11, 2009 12:14 pm

tulip1 wrote: What I try to say is you are right but in reallity you will find out that this is really hard.
We realise that, so we do stuff and make actions.
*COUGH* SHAMELESSPLUG *COUGH*
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Atheism, Atheist Ireland, Gaming, The Atheist Experience... what more could you want?
Tulip1
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Re: Muslim Public Affairs Committee

Post by Tulip1 » Tue Aug 11, 2009 11:20 pm

Irish Shaman wrote:
tulip1 wrote: What I try to say is you are right but in reallity you will find out that this is really hard.
We realise that, so we do stuff and make actions.
I ment it's hard to fight the religion as a whole, I (maybe we) see them as one and the same thing but every religion thinks they are special and diferent. So keep up the good work but I'm afraid you have to take them one by one.
Pope says atheists pick & choose their morals. Correct. Today I will be frowning on child abuse & not having a problem with homosexuality.
Feardorcha
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Re: Muslim Public Affairs Committee

Post by Feardorcha » Wed Aug 12, 2009 9:48 am

Hi Tulip,
I think the Nederland situation is very important for atheists, and democrats, in the rest of Europe.
A liberal democracy allows immigrants to retain their cultural difference - separate schools for language and religion. They increase and demand that national institutions change to respect their customs, even ones which are anathema to the democracy in which they live. Their extreme elements enforce this view with murder. Atheist politicians go into hiding. There's a political backlash and the old Christian religion makes a come-back.
We ignore this trend at our peril for in the countries where Islam rules (and like all religions it aspires to state power) atheists are eliminated.
We in AI are fighting for freedom of conscience and freedom of speech. The old enemy, Christianity, is in full retreat but there are darker forces on the increase.
Thanks for your input, Tulip, and can you recommend any good Dutch websites on the subject?
Tulip1
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Re: Muslim Public Affairs Committee

Post by Tulip1 » Thu Aug 13, 2009 8:03 am

Feardorcha wrote:Hi Tulip,
I think the Nederland situation is very important for atheists, and democrats, in the rest of Europe.
A liberal democracy allows immigrants to retain their cultural difference - separate schools for language and religion. They increase and demand that national institutions change to respect their customs, even ones which are anathema to the democracy in which they live. Their extreme elements enforce this view with murder. Atheist politicians go into hiding. There's a political backlash and the old Christian religion makes a come-back.
We ignore this trend at our peril for in the countries where Islam rules (and like all religions it aspires to state power) atheists are eliminated.
We in AI are fighting for freedom of conscience and freedom of speech. The old enemy, Christianity, is in full retreat but there are darker forces on the increase.
Thanks for your input, Tulip, and can you recommend any good Dutch websites on the subject?
they will all be in dutch, we have a active atheist group called De Vrije Gedachte which means Something like The Free Thought' http://www.devrijegedachte.nl/ can't find a translation in english though. Even in Holland the politicians don't really want to stand up against the islam because they don't want to be racist. We have one idiot Geert Wilders who does. Even though he has some good points he is not veru subtile in his views. Our late Pim Fortuyn was very good, much more subtile and always portraid as extreme right in the rest of europe. He was not though.
Pope says atheists pick & choose their morals. Correct. Today I will be frowning on child abuse & not having a problem with homosexuality.
Tulip1
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Re: Muslim Public Affairs Committee

Post by Tulip1 » Thu Aug 13, 2009 8:25 am

sorry my message window does strange when I get to the end.
He wanted a general pardon for everyone living illigally in Holland. It was a good example of what happens when you dare to stand up against a religion. The dead of the film director Theo van Gogh changed the feeling towards islam a lot but with the effect of people turning to christian party's. The worst of that is that the christian party's defend there religion and by doing that they defend all religions. We have a serious problem with the third generation moslims in Holland. There is a real us against them feeling which you can feel on the streets in the big city's. It was oneof the reasons for me to emmigrate as soon as I found out my wife was pregnant, I didn't want my kid to grow up in a agrasive enviroment like that. Addressing the problems often results in being accused of being a racist and then they don't address the problems anymore.

I noticed this happens alot here in Ireland when I attack (in words :wink: ) the islam aswell, as if religion is not a choice! I think the islam is by far the most agressive (big) religion we have around. Criticism is not accepted at all. As far as I'm cocerned the islam is in the same stage as the christians were in the dark ages with their crusades (jihad). I also think the christians are still doing their crusades but they call it war on terrorism.
Pope says atheists pick & choose their morals. Correct. Today I will be frowning on child abuse & not having a problem with homosexuality.
Irish Shaman
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Re: Muslim Public Affairs Committee

Post by Irish Shaman » Thu Aug 13, 2009 9:34 am

Well I reach quite a quite an audience with my YouTube so...

*shameless plug again*
http://www.youtube.com/1rishShaman

*ahem*

I'm starting to upload videogame content, walkthroughs for certain games, game reviews, movie reviews, music I like, basic stuff to get my channel more noticed than it already is.
So more people will come across it as the subliminal message that we atheists are attempting to take over the world.

Also I don't just cover "one" particular religious sect, depending on whats going on I might focus a debate, video or such towards those funny hat wearing muslims or those dress wearing priests. Sometimes all together as funny hat wearing priests in dresses: aka the Pope.

I don't waste time with MPAC.ie, since... well it's one Irish lad who thinks he is a muslim... srsly? I have more important movie topics and things to render. Unless he actually posts a video worthwhile replying too, he isn't.

Anyway, I have a LOT more stuff to get done for it, but my stoner uncle and his kid are here for the rest of the week, so not much new content will be up, but I'm going to be re-starting my facebook and other junky stuff so as I can spread my opinions further.

Any suggestions? I don't feel like opening a forum or such, that just is too hectic considering I have over 50+ comments to reply to individually along with debates on my YouTube channel alone.
*COUGH* SHAMELESSPLUG *COUGH*
http://www.youtube.com/1rishShaman

Atheism, Atheist Ireland, Gaming, The Atheist Experience... what more could you want?
Feardorcha
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Re: Muslim Public Affairs Committee

Post by Feardorcha » Thu Aug 13, 2009 10:08 am

Thanks Tulip for a very clear analysis of the situation in Holland (do you prefer Nederland?). I think we Irish atheists, democrats, free-thinkers need to start learning the Dutch lesson.
Have you thought about speaking at an AI meeting or other public platform? I'm sure if your spoken English is as clear as your writing it would be fine. I'll check out that website but the only Dutch I know is 'ham sandwich' which, of course, could get me killed in the wrong place.
Shaman: have you considered a competition to find the funniest religious hat? It would make a good YouTube video. My entry would be the Eastern Orthodox guy who has a great tower of crosses etc which he can raise and lower when he needs to kiss a picture.
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