Queen to visit Ireland

Discuss Irish and International politics
Mirthomaniac
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Re: Queen to visit Ireland

Post by Mirthomaniac » Tue Apr 05, 2011 10:11 pm

lostexpectation wrote:your reactions are against the terrorists, can you not also have a mature and independent reaction to the queen and the many legitimate reasons to oppose her visit.
To be honest, I don't believe that there are any legitimate reasons to oppose her visit, never mind many such reasons. All I've heard is that it might stir up trouble while costing us a lot of money at the same time. Oh, and the militant Republican 'what are you, a West Brit?' nonsense.

Sorry, but I'm dreadfully tired of even the dregs of nationalism and patriotism. I decide my culture. I decide what aspects of my Irishness to be proud of. I haven't a semblance of patriotism in me, as long as patriotism demands that I shoulder the grudges of the past and champion ideals which I do not call my own.
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Re: Queen to visit Ireland

Post by Dr Raskolnikov » Tue Apr 05, 2011 10:20 pm

Mirthomaniac wrote:
lostexpectation wrote:your reactions are against the terrorists, can you not also have a mature and independent reaction to the queen and the many legitimate reasons to oppose her visit.
To be honest, I don't believe that there are any legitimate reasons to oppose her visit, never mind many such reasons. All I've heard is that it might stir up trouble while costing us a lot of money at the same time. Oh, and the militant Republican 'what are you, a West Brit?' nonsense.

Sorry, but I'm dreadfully tired of even the dregs of nationalism and patriotism. I decide my culture. I decide what aspects of my Irishness to be proud of. I haven't a semblance of patriotism in me, as long as patriotism demands that I shoulder the grudges of the past and champion ideals which I do not call my own.
+1 etc.
Science is like a blabbermouth who ruins the movie by telling you how it ends. Well, I say there are some things we don't want to know. Important things. - Ned Flanders
chemicals
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Re: Queen to visit Ireland

Post by chemicals » Tue Apr 05, 2011 10:41 pm

Mirthomaniac wrote:Sorry, but I'm dreadfully tired of even the dregs of nationalism and patriotism. I decide my culture. I decide what aspects of my Irishness to be proud of. I haven't a semblance of patriotism in me, as long as patriotism demands that I shoulder the grudges of the past and champion ideals which I do not call my own.
+1 nicely put !
والقس هو مجنون
DaithiDublin
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Re: Queen to visit Ireland

Post by DaithiDublin » Wed Apr 06, 2011 3:11 am

funkyderek wrote:
mkaobrih wrote:You are both in denial – you are feigning indifference. Lost has spoken, Lost knows.
Yes, you're right. I'm pretending to be indifferent.

But only because I don't care.
:lol: I think I just cracked a rib! ;¬)


Q: Why did the republican chicken cross the Möbius strip?
A: To get to the same side.
As yet I have not found a single case of a terrestrial animal which fertilises itself.

- Charles Darwin, The Origin of Species
(he obviously never went to Bray)
lostexpectation
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Re: Queen to visit Ireland

Post by lostexpectation » Sat Apr 30, 2011 3:42 am

Mirthomaniac wrote:
lostexpectation wrote:your reactions are against the terrorists, can you not also have a mature and independent reaction to the queen and the many legitimate reasons to oppose her visit.
To be honest, I don't believe that there are any legitimate reasons to oppose her visit, never mind many such reasons. All I've heard is that it might stir up trouble while costing us a lot of money at the same time. Oh, and the militant Republican 'what are you, a West Brit?' nonsense.

Sorry, but I'm dreadfully tired of even the dregs of nationalism and patriotism. I decide my culture. I decide what aspects of my Irishness to be proud of. I haven't a semblance of patriotism in me, as long as patriotism demands that I shoulder the grudges of the past and champion ideals which I do not call my own.
again still mistaking me for member of the RIRA or something, i really think your talking to somebody else and reacting to imaginary militant republican that exists in your head, how about you address my arguments.

I said this about the royal wedding and it applies to this visit too, enda kenny and president may have to welcome them as is their positions but i won't be.
you know what this the celebration of an archaic tradition of monarchy the very definition of anti-democracy, a family that carries on Englands long history of aggressive imperialism and and to be figureheads for colonialisms that carries on right up to this very day around the world, william will follow his family like charles and andrew who's main job is to impress and cosy up to other repressive monarchs and bribe them with money, underage hookers and drugs so they can secure favourable arms and oil deals.
revolting and to be utterly and actively rejected by every modern person.

ps we should be supporting uk republicans
test
aZerogodist
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Re: Queen to visit Ireland

Post by aZerogodist » Sun May 01, 2011 2:55 pm

After seeing a clip of the wedding of these two people being treated like superior Humans, almost godlike worship, I find it kind of disturbing. Why the big show, how much did it cost, closing of the streets of London, rehearsals, security cost. They could of just got married in a private little chapel.
If we had a President of Ireland getting married would it be the same pompous state affair?

I'm still ok with the Q visit, but have reservations in the visit being treated as important or as a state event. She has not been elected to state office by the people of England, so really she doesn't represent them, what she does represent is the old imperial world view, an outdated undemocratic dictatorship.

BTW I have no interest in the objections to her visit due to events in Ireland that preceded WW1, as none of us where around at the time, and if someone wants someone to blame then shouldn't it be Diarmait Mac Murchada
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Re: Queen to visit Ireland

Post by mkaobrih » Sun May 01, 2011 9:22 pm

aZerogodist wrote:After seeing a clip of the wedding of these two people being treated like superior Humans, almost godlike worship, I find it kind of disturbing. Why the big show, how much did it cost, closing of the streets of London, rehearsals, security cost. They could of just got married in a private little chapel.
If we had a President of Ireland getting married would it be the same pompous state affair?
Well I suppose it’s like one big advert for Britain. 24 million people in Britain watched also 23 million Americans and supposedly 2 billion worldwide (I doubt that figure, there is only 6-7 billion people on the planet it’s unlikely that 33% are interested in British royalty – maybe it’s just on while they are in the pub?). Those stats are not to be sniffed at. I expect sales of anything they were wearing, eating, driving, or using will rocket. She did look very nice though. Hope she has a nice life - I’d hate to have all that publicity thrust upon me I’d run in the other direction.
The church complains of persecution when it's not allowed to persecute.
Mirthomaniac
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Re: Queen to visit Ireland

Post by Mirthomaniac » Mon May 02, 2011 5:19 am

lostexpectation wrote: again still mistaking me for member of the RIRA or something, i really think your talking to somebody else and reacting to imaginary militant republican that exists in your head, how about you address my arguments.

I said this about the royal wedding and it applies to this visit too, enda kenny and president may have to welcome them as is their positions but i won't be.
I didn't mistake you for anything. Your posts implied that people need to agree with you and your distaste for what the Queen represents. They also implied that a 'mature' reaction to the Queen's visit could only be filled with said distaste, again because of what she represents. I specifically said that there were no arguments against her visit that held water. You can oppose it all you want, and repudiate everything about it, but there are no 'mature' arguments (that I am aware of) against some old figurehead coming to our country. Your insistence that we 'should' do things (e.g. 'we should be supporting UK Republicans') doesn't go with me either. I specifically said that I'm tired of any remaining nationalism or patriotism as some imperative 'duty'. I will decide whom to support for myself. I am by no means a patriot in the sense you seem to consider mandatory.

I never mentioned RIRA-level militant behaviour. I specifically mentioned the shouldering of past grudges (something that you seem to insist upon) and the championing of ideals that I don't agree with. If you can give a genuine argument against the visit that isn't based solely on 'imperialism was bad' or 'I don't agree with flamboyant diplomats', then I will address it.
Tulip1
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Re: Queen to visit Ireland

Post by Tulip1 » Mon May 02, 2011 4:13 pm

As a total outsider I don't understand this discussion. In my humble opinion it would be the same as the Dutch oposing the German Bund Kanselier to visit Holland because of the war.
Pope says atheists pick & choose their morals. Correct. Today I will be frowning on child abuse & not having a problem with homosexuality.
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Re: Queen to visit Ireland

Post by funkyderek » Mon May 02, 2011 6:56 pm

Tulip1 wrote:As a total outsider I don't understand this discussion. In my humble opinion it would be the same as the Dutch oposing the German Bund Kanselier to visit Holland because of the war.
Sounds like you do understand it. :D
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